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Post by Westie on Jan 26, 2022 22:50:03 GMT
I really don’t get them. I’m not talking £300 cartridges here although that’s far from cheap. I’m talking about some pretty mass-market jobbies that are over a grand and sometimes pushing two grand.
I don’t think cartridges go much past about 700 hours before losing their mojo a bit. That means a £2k cartridge costs you £3 an hour to use. And then folk pay over half the new value on the used market for examples that have likely had more than 500 hours on them. It’s madness when Audio Technica and Denon still keep it real with good cartridges at low prices.
Cartridges can’t justify huge prices AFAIK. For one, they aren’t much better than the great value ones I’ve mentioned and for another they have a very short lifespan.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 27, 2022 10:03:26 GMT
Ferkin rip off. The guy that re-tips the B&O cartridges quotes 2000 hours for a line contact Diamond & 4000 hours for a Micro Ridge Diamond.
However for years on end have i tried finding a cartridge that sounds better to me than my cheap SHURE 'M75ED/2'.
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Post by Westie on Jan 27, 2022 12:10:59 GMT
This is the thing for me. The fancy Stylus profiles seem to cost a huge chunk more where some makers are concerned, yet the actual fancily cut diamonds are only slightly more expensive to buy.
To me, that means makers exploiting people. Make one or two profiles and only charge proportionately extra for the most expensive one.
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Post by dsjr on Jan 27, 2022 13:21:51 GMT
Line style tips seem to just get 'sharper' as they age I found using a proper microscope, they dig ever deeper into the groove and the main issue then becomes clogging up more easily and showing records pressed from knackered stampers (I have a cut of 'Rock of The Westies' like that - and a well loved Stilton OC9 (mk1 I suspect) cartridge as some kind of proof as the two just don't play  ML styli as Shure used can wear badly it seems, but as for properly made ellipticals, I did have for a while a Godbug Mr Brier that Jimmy H used for many many hundreds of hours and it sounded fantastic - i should have shut the eff up about it but I didn't and the distributor (who used to be a colleague) came a'calling to take it back... Styli on popular priced cartridges (up to a couple of hundred quid) may not be so well grain-orientated and so on and may wel wear more quickly. Anyway, I remember a statement from Roy Gandy that a cartridge costing thousands (in today's money) is only worth it if the body is a gemstone or similar (Kiseki may have had an excuse back then). Rega now make some seriously expensive cartridges so heaven knows if his statement still holds true  |
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Post by Westie on Jan 27, 2022 16:10:24 GMT
I must say I liked the special elliptical stylus of the original OC9 over any of the Microlines that followed. The OC9 XML really didn’t do anything for me.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 27, 2022 16:14:39 GMT
I learned ny lesson to stick with standard Ellipticals years ago.
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Post by classicrock on Jan 29, 2022 13:48:52 GMT
AT claim their ellipticals only last 400 hours but give 1000 for ML and 800 for Shibata. I rather like the sound of the later. Better bass and less cold/bright top end than the Microline. I seriously doubt there is a vast sound advantage between a £600 MC and £1200. I've heard some great sounding exotically priced cartridges in demos but I think you may need the best turntables to get the best out of them. One would assume the diamond quality on these should give a longer life (maybe 2000 hours). The problem a stylus is a limited life / disposable commodity rather than turntables and arms which can last a lifetime if cared for. Unfortunately Ortofon and other manufacturers now have very inflated prices. Difficult to justify anything above the AT OC9 or AT33 ranges.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 29, 2022 13:56:34 GMT
The thing is i used to have a Styli microscope up until recently. My late father had an old Shure 'M55' with the elliptical styli. Hed used this for 30 years on more than a regular basis plus his records were not in the greatest of condition. I have that same Cartridge in a box. the magnification check showed that its still perfectly fine. So how does that work when they give measly hours for the life of a styli?
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Post by Westie on Jan 29, 2022 16:26:30 GMT
AT claim their ellipticals only last 400 hours but give 1000 for ML and 800 for Shibata. I rather like the sound of the later. Better bass and less cold/bright top end than the Microline. I seriously doubt there is a vast sound advantage between a £600 MC and £1200. I've heard some great sounding exotically priced cartridges in demos but I think you may need the best turntables to get the best out of them. One would assume the diamond quality on these should give a longer life (maybe 2000 hours). The problem a stylus is a limited life / disposable commodity rather than turntables and arms which can last a lifetime if cared for. Unfortunately Ortofon and other manufacturers now have very inflated prices. Difficult to justify anything above the AT OC9 or AT33 ranges. Yep I like Shibatas too. Just sound more sassy and alive. I completely agree with where you draw the line price-wise too. |
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Post by Westie on Jan 29, 2022 16:29:25 GMT
The thing is i used to have a Styli microscope up until recently. My late father had an old Shure 'M55' with the elliptical styli. Hed used this for 30 years on more than a regular basis plus his records were not in the greatest of condition. I have that same Cartridge in a box. the magnification check showed that its still perfectly fine. So how does that work when they give measly hours for the life of a styli? I think the figures quoted are often pointing to the time that the sound no longer meets the specs. They may last a lot longer. I’m told that the wear patterns are only really visible looking at them from the bottom and you need a really powerful microscope. I stress here that this is what I’ve read and that’s different from me saying it’s something I know for myself some illustrations here:. thevinylpress.com/the-finish-line-for-your-phonograph-stylus/ |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 29, 2022 19:24:04 GMT
Yeh but 30 years of nearly everyday use on poor quality records showing no tip wear, That is a really lot of hours.
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